Dyskenetic syndrome

[johnmccorry]

my sympathies...very sad to lose a pet like that!
i hope i never am faced with a choice like that...

Couldn't have said it any better James, but at the same time very intresting and sad thread this, but has opened my eyes to future problems, learning things all the time here, i just hope i don't get cornered like that.

[Taki Tsonis]

Just an update on my previous post on about page 3 which nobody answered!

I must share my L klugi's story with you all. I got 3 T's from a guy, all of which seemed very energetic to me when I got them. However I soon realised that they weren't energetic, they all had Dyskinetic syndrome. 2 of them died pretty soon and my L klugi was on the brink. He couldn't catch anything to eat, was dancing around on hot coals all the time. He def. had the syndrome 100%. I persisted in force feeding him with a long tweezers (would stick the crickets in his frantic fangs), and kept him with a big bowl of liquid gel that they sell in the petshops. I often used to manouvere him over the gel to make sure he would hydrate. This went on for about 6 months when to my surprise he moulted. He still had the syndrome, but it seemed ever so slightly better. I continuede with the same process and he moulted again 6 months later! Yet again there was improvement and he started catching his own crickets (albeit rather hit & miss). He recently matured (male) and he is about 20cm legspan now. The symptoms have all but vanished and he seems perfect!

Everything I had read pointed to me rather putting him out of his misery, and it's rather satisfying & amazing that he has completely recovered!!!! My personal opinion is that the gel helped, cause it was a constant supply of hydration without the risk of drowning (lost the other 2 when I found them drowned in 1cm of water). And of course tons of patience trying to make sure he ate all his crickets. With time it worked......

[James Box]

that's pretty amazing, Taki!
reminds me of the treatment Ray Gabriel proscribed in a BTS journal article about wet moults.
with continued, careful treatment, these things don't have to mean death.

exciting times...there's new hope in the war against nematode worms, hope for wet moults and now hope for dyskinetic syndrome victims

[Taki Tsonis]

I can't tell you how chuffed I am after all the effort I put into this one in the beggining!

[James Box]

i know what you mean
with such mysterious animals, actually nursing them back to health feels great! it makes up for the sleepless nights, at any rate

[Colin D Wilson]

Taki,
Refering back to post 37 of this thread.

You didn't happen to make notes about any of this did you?
if you did, i would really appreciate it if you could type them up and email them to me.

congratulations, fantastic result!

Colin

[Taki Tsonis]

Sorry Colin, I didn't keep notes as I wasn't really too hopeful in the begining, however I do remember it all very well. Is there anything specific you would like to know, or should I just write as detailed an account as I can remember and send it to you? I have a fair recollection of the ones that died too.

[Colin D Wilson]

A detailed account would be great thanks
approximate time between moults would be handy as would growth rate sizes.

Thanks again Taki

[Taki Tsonis]

Ok, I'll put it together asap

[Colin D Wilson]

Thanks for sparing the time to do this Taki, much appreciated

Colin

[James Box]

sadly i have to resurrect this thread.
i purchased a pair of Aphonopelma aberrans for the purpose of breeding them, and the sub-adult male has begun showing the signs of "dyskinetic syndrome"

i am hoping to get him through it, and will be taking Taki's advice (is he around these days?) as he didn't give up, and nor do i plan to.

however given how little is known about this syndrome, i am thinking the last thing i should do is breed him. his genes may be messed up...and passing them on would be cruel, unless there is some experimental value that could come from that.
but that is if he survives.
Colin, if you're still compiling knowledge on this subject, i'll try to help.
i am rather gutted...he's a new spider to me, the species in general is new to the hobby, and the least concern is that it wasn't exactly cheap.
but it is the risk you run, otherwise healthy looking spiders can without warning develop problems. i've had it before and i'm sure it'll happen again

[Bruce Maclean]

Hi all,

Sorry I'm coming in late to this discussion....I'm a vet dealing with exotic animals, and I've recently been dealing with a couple of tarantulas in a collection with neurological signs.

Preliminary results from haemolymph sampling look very interesting (awaiting more info) and I have one gone for post mortem, awaiting results at the moment. Anyway, the point is that it is always worth considering getting any affected animals tested in any way possible, to build up more information on the disease process.

Doing it through an organisation such as the BTS has advantages in that more samples can go to the same place so the pathologist(s) get more experience, rather than few cases scattered around via different labs etc. Getting pathology results on these cases is the only thing that's likely to get much information on tarantula health problems. If you are euthanasing the tarantula (or can get it preserved reasonably quickly after death) then it is surely worth getting a post mortem done.

With regards to euthanasia, just a further thought - via anaesthesia from a vets is as humane a way as you'll get, so should be considered where possible.

Anyway, hope this helps and hasn't gone over old ground too much!

[Richard Shah]

We had a nice debate in English about animal rights people who basically take things too far.
Most people think that they just want attention, and that they really have nothing better to do but to say and do stupid things, like that group PETA. I really liked the way South Park mocked them, but it's true.

One case I read about which I thought was so bizzarre, was when a woman wanted to make her DEAD cat into a pillow, so she went to a comapny who were able to perform that. However when the press and activists found out, she started receiving death-threats and people said she was guilty of animal cruelty.

Now, is it just me or is it totally illogical to think this, since this is her dead pet cat, and she clearly loved it so wanted to turn him into a pillow, claiming she "will always be able to have [her] cat on the sofa", that doing this is cruel to the animal??

Maybe if you say that she's damaging the body of what was once a living thing, but should now be resting in peace, but even so they weren't saying that!


Any way more to this topic, sorry Kain for your loss, and I think the most humane way to kill a an invertebrate would be to take it to an area in which a mess wouldn't disturb the surroundings much and you wouldn't have to clean it up, put the creature on a flat surface and take a slab, also with a flat surface, and dropped it from directly above so that you get the entire creature. Done.

I had to do it with a cricket I accidentally injured when transferring him from the cricket box to the cricket tank.

Thanks,

Rich.

[Matthew Baines]

Coming from a poor farming background its sometimes impossible too be able too afford the extravagant prices charged by the vets for humane euthanasia . If a chicken was ill you would just ring its neck or drown the cats and up until recently cut the pig/sheep's throat. So im used too most of the brutal ways of putting an animal out of its misery which is the quick and painless way. Not too keen on the freezing of animals ( Even tho i was told that u should put a tarantula in the fridge first too slow it down so its numb and then put it in the freezer too finish it off) If/ when it comes too the crunch(excuse the pun thats coming up) I would rather the tarantula be flattened and killed instantly and die painlessly than it suffering more than it should just so i had a perfect specimin too show too folks. Thats my opinion and id rather have the mess than the suffering any day!

[James Box]

i am not going to euthanise the tarantula!
there is every reason to hope for its recovery, and while there's hope i will not give up.
i didn't bring this thread back to discuss that issue at all (it has been debated ad nauseum already in this thread and others), but to get thoughts and maybe new info on this syndrome.

i have a living spider here who is ''suffering'', and i wish to help it recover and further knowledge to fight this problem wherever else it occurs.
my main concern now is that it is not going to be good breeding stock if it makes it to maturity, if it is a genetic issue.
i was attempting to forcefeed it a cricket tonight, and while it took a bite, it didn't seem interested in holding on.
it is truly distressing to see it in such obvious discomfort, and i hope that i can coax it through.
the most gutting thing is the very good chance he won't survive to breed or that even if he does it won't be advisable