Poecilotheria Metallica

[Craig Toon]

All,

I have 3 P metallica all around a simllar size which is around 5-6inch however regarding the sex to each of them,I am not sure as they always seem to destroy the exuvium in the area I need to check. I have checked the palps on all three P Metallicas and none have embolus bulbs at this moment in time.

Is there anyway of telling the difference between Male and female visually as I have heard of different methods off Facebook i.e. admomen patterns exct. is this True? I probably doubt it.

I am pretty sure the only reliable way is to get a good Exuvium but just wondered if there is any other signs that could point me in the right direction.


One of the P Mets molted last week but again destroyed the exuvium, however the ventral side looks different to the others. is there a difference in the ventral sides of MM and A/F or are they the same?

Regards

Craig Toon

[Adam Beynon - Jones]

I'm not having much luck with poecilotheria moults either - I've heard they are notorious for destroying them - I have several large slings, and some grown on juvies - I'm usually pretty quick to get to the moults, and I have had success at unraveling some pretty tiny moults of other species, and have been able to sex a few with my microscope - but not with the pokies ! Even when using the tiniest amount of an atomiser mister to wet the moults, they seem to be very brittle and just fall apart/disintegrate - this is moults of 1-3" spiders, roughly. So I wouldn't like to think how maddening it must be with sub adults!!!

Anyway - some Poecilotheria can be guessed quite effectively by looking at the epigastric region, and also the foley stripe on the abdomen. I can't remember exactly which ones it is more true of, but I'm sure it is the case with P. regalis and older (ie. sub adult +) P. metallica. If the foley stripe has a notably dark stripe running down the middle it is likely male, whereas if the whole stripe is much the same shade of "white" it is likely female.

With the epigastric region, females tend to have a more obvious lip that runs straight between the book lungs, whereas males do not have such an obvious opening (the gonopore being much smaller) and also have a dot (epiandrous fusillae) of darker hair immediately above the epigastric furrow - this is obviously less easy to see on darker specimens, and also is more apparent on younger individuals by it's absence (ie. epiandrous fusillae under-developed, therefore a more obvious bald dot is visible). Sometimes, if you take a close up picture under natural light with a half decent camera that takes good macro pictures, you can see a contrast that you wouldn't otherwise see with the naked eye - ie, contrast of epiandrous fusillae in males.

As you, and we all know, none of this is an exact science, whereas sexing by moult is - sometimes ventral sexing is very obvious, a lot of the time it's not, so is it really worth going nuts over it? BUT if you're going nuts failing to get decent moults anyway, it's well worth having a look into these things - which, incidentally are probably more accurate if you have a few similar sized spiders to compare - which you do

I'd say it's quite possible that the one that looks notably different ventrally is a different sex to the others (if the difference is of the epigastric region). You just need to figure out which is which - Also, you'll not have long to wait to find out at those sizes anyway

I know a lot of people think this is all a waste of time and don't bother with it, but for some reason it fascinates me, regardless of how accurate it is, so I enjoy speculating and "making bets with myself" over which of my own spiders turn out to be male or female... I've genuinely been right with the last several species I've tried to guess, but I'm better with terrestrial new worlds.

I had a 5" P. metallica (which I lost due to reasons unknown) that was sold to me as a female - I was unsure, so I put pictures up on another forum, and was told it was female, but it looked male to me dorsally. It's maddening but interesting too

This is the one I had...

[Craig Toon]

Adam,

I have posted some pictures of two of my P. Metallica please let me know your thoughts,



and below are the Ventral shots for the above picture



and another ventral shot for the same P Met.



I personally think that the above 3 pictures are female. please see pictures of my other P Met below.




and below are the ventral shots of this P Met



I think this one could be male however this is a molt behind the 1st P Met shown in the pictures above

Regards

Craig Toon

[Adam Beynon - Jones]

If I were a betting man, that's definitely where I'd be putting my money as well

[NikiJoDolby]

I'd say the 3rd pic is female, the last male. The second looks female as well, but get a better opinion than mine. Good luck

[Paul Gee]

I always thought another way of sexing a spider is to look for Tibial hooks on the front legs.

[Stuart Baker]

I always thought another way of sexing a spider is to look for Tibial hooks on the front legs.

Only adult males have tibial spurs. These are never present on juveniles. Some species (including all Poecilothera), lack them all together.

[Phil Geraghty]

Guys, try putting some fairy liquid/washing detergent in with the water you use to moisten the exuvia. Sounds daft, but it stops the exuvia from being so brittle.
Best of luck!

[Phil Geraghty]

(one tiny drop of fairy liquid by the way... And let the water soak into the exuvia for a while!)

[Craig Toon]

Phil,

That's all well and good if the molt is still in tact. A lot of spiders chew the molt for moisture after the molt process and its always in the area you require for sexing

[Adam Beynon - Jones]

^ Agreed - I've been using the moistening/detergent trick for years, but if it's wrecked it's wrecked. And Pokies seem to know how to wreck them properly!