Please help, really worried

[vax]

I got my first ever tarantula today, have transferred it from the small plastic container it came in into a glass aquarium. I put the heat mat under half the tank, as directed. The tank has a plastic lid with holes in, the floor is covered with the same sort of bark chippings they had in the shop, but the walls are covered in steam. Am I cooking the spider? Should I turn the heat mat off?

I'm really panicking and don't know what to do, or whether this is normal. Do I need a completely different sort of container? I could put it back into the plastic one for the time being, but this is more cat-proof. More ventilation? There was nobody at the petshop to answer my questions and I'm not 100% sure what sort of spider it is - it just said 'zebra knee'. It moves very quickly. I really hope somebody can help, I'm so worried and wish I'd waited until I could speak to the person who knows about spiders. I went to get a mexican red-knee but was seduced by this spider instead.

Please please advise if you can.

[karl]

Most substrate will give off some moisture when you first put it in a tank with a heat source, this isn't a problem as long as the tank has good ventilation. However, if there is a lot of condensation you should remove the spider to a seperate container until the substrate has dried out a little.

'zebra knee' is a bit vague, maybe Aphonopelma seemanni? ...

http://www.birdspiders.com/archive/15AFFEC6KD0B7KAEC2K143980443D2BE497.html

If that's the case then this species doesn't do well with too much humidity.

If you don't have another container to put the spider in while the substrate dries out a bit then remove the substrate and heat it in the oven on a low heat for a while, until some of the moisture dries up. Remember to cool it before returning it to the spider's tank (of course).

Keep in mind that your spider will be ok without substrate for a while as long as she has somewhere to hide and a water source. If you put her in a tank without substrate DO NOT give her a heat mat, just keep her in the warmest room in the house.

Also, bark chippings are not a good substrate if your spider is a burrower, but I guess we can sort that out at another time.

A thought just occured ... you didn't put the water bowl over where the heat mat is, did you?

karl

[vax]

Thanks so much for your reply. I really appreciate it, close to tears at the moment. There's no water bowl at all, they said to put some wet cotton wool in which I did, and it's away from the heat mat. In fact I've moved the heat mat so that it's under only a bare quarter of the tank to see if that helps. I looked up aphonopelma seemani and it certainly fits the description - especially the sudden speed, eg: when I moved it into the tank. It really startled me. I feel a bit upset that the people in the shop have let me buy all the wrong things, and now my spider is in a sort of sauna.

I've taken a pic from above, with the lid off. You can see all the water droplets, though the steam/condensation went away with the lid off. Maybe can confirm the species from this:

[vax]

[Neil Richardson]

Ditch the cotton wool asap, it'll be a breeding ground for all manner of nasties.

Use a shallow dish, something like the lid off of a coffee jar, or similar. Just make sure there's no danger of the spider falling in and drowning.

It might work better with the heatmat stuck to the back of the tank instead of underneath as well.

[vax]

Ok, have propped the heat mat up against the back and it has definitely reduced the level of condensation. Also switched the cotton wool for a very shallow dish, I'm feeling more relaxed but the spider is rubbing 3 of its legs together on one side - does this mean anything? Sorry to be so pathetic, I'll go to another shop tomorrow and see what they advise re: enclosures. I don't think this tank has enough ventilation.

Thanks ever so much for your help.

[karl]

From the pic I would say she's Aphonopelma seemanni. They come in two colour forms, one black, one brown.

Not the best first spider to own in my opinion. They are fast and aggressive, but they do look absolutely WONDERFUL.

As Neil said, remove the cotten wool. This is something that pet shops seem to pass on time after time ... but would you drink your water from a sponge that has been hanging around for a couple of days? Bacteria find a perfect home in cotton wool, you do the math.

Sorry to disagree with Neil but I would never put a heat mat on the side or the back of a tank. The heat comes into direct contact with the sides of the tank and therefore it's possible for a spider to sit there and slowly roast itself. But maybe that's just my paranoia.

You can take comfort in that fact that you came here first, even before buying a spider, and you have a good source of information relating to your new baby.

Someone on a spider mailing list I am on recently called tarantulas 'venomous goldfish' ... meaning they should be looked at and not touched. This is the case with A.seemanni ... please don't think you have a hand pet, no matter how cute she looks

[karl]

If she's rubbing legs together she's having a wash and brush-up ... that means she's recovering from a bad day

Take into consideration that the tank might be ok, but the substrate might be too damp before you go spending more cash on another tank. Dry the substrate a little, then try again.

[vax]

Aggressive? :: gulps ::

They shouldn't be allowed to sell spiders that are not suitable for beginners to absolute beginners should they? They should know a bit about what they are selling. Nobody said anything about this one not being an ideal first spider, but not sure I could have been dissuaded anyway. It just looked so beautiful. They also had those orange baboon spiders (sorry I don't know the latin names) and would have sold me one of those, but even I knew from my v limited research that they are not the best choice for beginners.

I couldn't have made the decision to have one without knowing there was somewhere to turn for advice - my sister has a chilean rose (probably a better choice for me), and I've been to several shops (and the zoo of course) while I was mulling it over. I really do appreciate the advice here.

I did promise myself that I would wait six months and if it was still a good idea to have one then, I would go for it. I just couldn't wait that long though. I managed nearly six weeks since the urge first came over me!

[Mark Pennell]

Hi
The heat mat should be on the back of the tank and never underneath. Heat mats under the tank may thermal block ( see mats instructions about this) This will cause it to overheat, and most likley fail, or worse catch fire!


Any way, in 23 years of keeping and breeding tarantulas I have always used the mat at the back of the tank, backed up with a few sheets of polystyrene to reflect the heat back into the tank. Never had any problems what so ever.

A thermostat is recomended but if its a low wat mat its not needed. JUst make sure you have a temp guage in or on the tank.

Give your new spider a few days to settle in and it will be fine.

Regards
Mark

[Neil Richardson]

Plus with the heatmat stuck to the back (i use masking tape normally) the spider can move away from it if it's too warm / cold and regulate its temperature.

Most spiders will tend to burrow down to escape heat, so if the mat is at the bottom, they'll dig down and only get warmer, confusing the poor dears.


Condensation at this point probably isn't a problem, it's just the substrate dying out, give it a week and it should be cleared up.

[karl]

You know, the BTS has a bulletin board where various hobbyists and traders offer spiders ... if you combine that with this forum you pretty much have everything you need to find your perfect first spider.

Pet shops are like any other shop (much to our dismay), it's a business, and their business is selling things.

Think yourself lucky that you didn't go for the 'orange baboon spiders' ... probably Pterinochilus murinus ...

http://www.birdspiders.com/archive/15B03BC3KD0B7KAEC2K14C0A3CFF1BA69B8.html

They are complete turbo nutters but extremely common in the hobby. I would hate to think of a first time keeper ending up with one of those babies.

For what it's worth, any spider that you get should be treated as a 'hands off' kind of deal. Handling should only carried out when absolutely essential, and you should respect these beasties as wild animals. If you follow that route then any aggression on their part is minimalised.

karl

[karl]

Correct me if I'm wrong, and I'm sure you will a heat mat without thermostatic control will run at full tilt and get damn hot if there is no air flow in the room/tank.

For a single spider tank (in this case) most of the mat will be exposed to the air and not be conducting into the tank.

[vax]

They are purdy too, but I remember someone telling me not to have one of those. On my 'arachnophobe' thread there was a pink zebra spider suggested as an ok first spider, but I now see that my 'zebra'and that one are two very different animals.

I suppose I should really have found out more about it before taking the plunge, but it's done now. Should I really have to have much contact? Will fish the bits of dead cricket out with tweezers and be quick with the water refill.

[Howard Farley (Huk7)]

A.seemani are very nice spiders and in the grand scheme of things are not really that aggressive in my experience, but they are quick.

There are both worse and better spiders to go for as a beginner, but it's by no means a complete loss. So do not despair.

On the subject of substrate, I will echo what everyone else said about it just drying out, the relatively short time this takes will not cause the spider any harm during this period of high(ish) humidity.

However, you may seriously want to consider a different substrate. Those bark chips will never form a suitable burrow and seemanni's do like to dig. I would suggest you use a 100% peat/vermiculite mix (approx 70/30 mix), you can buy both at B&Q. If you want instructions as to how to prepare this then by all means e-mail me, as it's a bit long winded for here. This will then allow the spider to burrow, I use this for all of my spiders and have done for more years than I care to mention, as long as you are good with tank maintainence, very few problems arise.

The subject of substrate normally causes great debate, with everyone having their favourites, this is mine and it works for me, that's all I can say.

I will fully second the comment regarding the removal of the cotton wool and replacing with fresh water.

You are very much in the early days, the hobby is a big learning curve, but it is enjoyable along the way. We have all been there at one time and that's why we are more than happy to help out now.

I don't think it's a case of the shop selling you the wrong equipment, as usually they are generally ill informed of the correct care of T's themselves, so are only selling what 'in their eyes' they consider to be the correct stuff, rightly or wrongly.

Hope this is of some use.