How kill mouse?

[H@GG!S]

before this turns into a RAY the BUTCHER from Swindon thread

LoL Elton the killer ....... I feed my T's mice that my cat supplys free of charge on a regular basis. Most are stunned or injured some dead, ive tryed putting them in a container to revive and putting them back out side but my cat will just bring them back in minus a head or limbs. So i feal the best way to deal with it is to let one of my T's finish them off, pic's supplyed of cource

[Bentrix]

mice Supplying cat

Hey haggis great idea, problem being is with any wild caught prey you need to be careful what pesticides are used in the local area.
Saying that unless the cat dies or looks incredably high you should be fine! LOL
Is that a G. rosea eating a mouse cause my adult female used to be so picky with food would only eat brown crickets!

[Oderus]

A sugested "humane" way to kill a rodent is to pick it up by the tail and swing the back of its head against a hard surface such as a table top, breaking the neck.

When done right this is indeed clean and fast (one hit) and legal (unlike live feeding) many ppl prefer the C02 tank way and this is used by large scale rodent breeder's.

On a lighter note ( maybe? ) Feeding Live Verts is a topic that comes up alot when feeding snakes and other reptiles especially when the animal in question is wild caught and will only feed on live prey. Which is more humane to feed live prey animals or starve the animal, both of which are inhumane and illegal in the UK. (ill leave that up to the lawyers to sort out!)

When this does get into the courts it comes down too proving if that was indeed the case (i.e. would the animal have died if not offered live vert's as food).

BTW iirc it was Ray "the Baseball Bat" not the butcher

[Chris Sainsbury]

Unfortunately I don't think your allowed to prekill your own vertebrates for tarantula consumption in the UK?. As your from Poland I do not know if your laws allow this but im sure no one from the uk can help really?.

Why would no one from the UK be able to help? Do British people import all pre-killed inverts from overseas to feed to their Reptiles? Its not illegal to prekill vertebrates for food but it is illegal to feed live vertebrates to your animals. Thats the way I understand it anyway.

To be honest mate I have witnessed live vert prey fed to tarantulas in the past and its over for the prey in a matter of seconds so really speaking I would feed live if laws permitted as I cannot see a humane way of pre-killing a mouse from a human point of view. Other than that you can feed inverts to your tarantulas this is a healthy staple diet but again we could argue that in the wild the tarantula you would like to feed the mouse would take mice lizards frogs well basically anything it can over power

This is not always the case! I once fed a live baby mouse (pinky) to an adult Poecilotheria formosa,(your allowed to do this in Germany) which it took quite quickly and proceeded to feast on it strate away. The baby mouse however did not die a quick death and continued to squeak for around 45 minutes! After this incident I have never fed live invert food to my tarantulas.Belive me this is kind of offputting!
As for feeding live frogs,lizards etc.I think to do this, especially in the UK is not a good thing! the reason for this is because many if not all frogs/lizards etc are getting rarer and rarer ,so trying to conserve what valuable native wildlife there is in Europe is much more important than feeding your tarantulas,what at the end of the day they can do without! You have to remember what might be common in you back garden/area may not be common in many other areas of England or Europe. To that end I think the feeding of your native frogs/lizerds etc to your tarantulas is not only most likely against the law ,but also irresponsible however quick they might die.
Just my opinion anyway.

[RichardDegville]

Why would no one from the UK be able to help? Do British people import all pre-killed inverts from overseas to feed to their Reptiles? Its not illegal to prekill vertebrates for food but it is illegal to feed live vertebrates to your animals. Thats the way I understand it anyway.

I couldent say I dont know if its legal or not but you know how people get slammed on forums at even a sniff of feeding live verts let alone killing them yourself beforehand so thats why I put what I put.

This is not always the case! I once fed a live baby mouse (pinky) to an adult Poecilotheria formosa,(your allowed to do this in Germany) which it took quite quickly and proceeded to feast on it strate away. The baby mouse however did not die a quick death and continued to squeak for around 45 minutes! After this incident I have never fed live invert food to my tarantulas.Belive me this is kind of offputting!

Yeh I remember you telling me this ( you may not )I have seen many verts etc killed by tarantulas and have never seen nor heared anything like that what happened to you it was indeed sad but thats life.

As for feeding live frogs,lizards etc.I think to do this, especially in the UK is not a good thing! the reason for this is because many if not all frogs/lizards etc are getting rarer and rarer ,so trying to conserve what valuable native wildlife there is in Europe is much more important than feeding your tarantulas,what at the end of the day they can do without! You have to remember what might be common in you back garden/area may not be common in many other areas of England or Europe. To that end I think the feeding of your native frogs/lizerds etc to your tarantulas is not only most likely against the law ,but also irresponsible however quick they might die.

reread the post plz I dident mention feeding native frogs lizards etc I refered to what tarantulas would take in the wild as prey. nice read mind

[Chris Sainsbury]

Yeh I remember you telling me this ( you may not )I have seen many verts etc killed by tarantulas and have never seen nor heared anything like that what happened to you it was indeed sad but thats life.

I hope that when you saw all these vertebrates that were killed by tarantulas you were not in the UK! But then as a law abiding respectful British citizen I´m sure if you had seen it happen in the UK, you would have said something about the laws on doing this to the person performing this act , or is it all video footage you have seen?

reread the post plz I dident mention feeding native frogs lizards etc I refered to what tarantulas would take in the wild as prey.
nice read mind

Your quite right Rich you never said anything about feeding native frogs etc, to tarantulas, but you did say -

Other than that you can feed inverts to your tarantulas this is a healthy staple diet but again we could argue that in the wild the tarantula you would like to feed the mouse would take mice lizards frogs well basically anything it can over power.

This is why I put the thing about the native frogs etc, as people who may read this and get the idea "lets try frogs instead of mice as they eat them in the wild don´t they!" hopefully think twice before going out there and collecting them in their back gardens etc. Because these same people are highly unlikely to go to the local pet shop and buy expensive exotic species that come from the tarantulas home country.
I just thought this is a vaid point to make, as I´ve seen video footage and photos posted on another English web site a long while back showing that this has happend in the past.
Im glad you found it a nice read because I had a nice time writeing it.

[RichardDegville]

I hope that when you saw all these vertebrates that were killed by tarantulas you were not in the UK! But then as a law abiding respectful British citizen I´m sure if you had seen it happen in the UK, you would have said something about the laws on doing this to the person performing this act , or is it all video footage you have seen?

No it was in the UK but I cannot dictate to anyone how to conduct there own lives or hobbies legal or not only observe I have also seen video footage however most time no sound so you don't hear the cracking of bones etc personally I don't have a problem with feeding live food verts anfibs inverts anything that a tarantula could over power but due to legal reasons I cannot feed as the people that make the laws are god and place values on life forms just because they look cute not that a life is a life regardless of what sensual awareness it may have. there are people I know that have the self awareness of an amoeba but still drive a car!

This is why I put the thing about the native frogs etc, as people who may read this and get the idea "lets try frogs instead of mice as they eat them in the wild don´t they!" hopefully think twice before going out there and collecting them in their back gardens etc. Because these same people are highly unlikely to go to the local pet shop and buy expensive exotic species that come from the tarantulas home country.
I just thought this is a vaid point to make, as I´ve seen video footage and photos posted on another English web site a long while back showing that this has happend in the past.

There will always be Impressionable people im afraid these people close your eyes now!




This is a desktop from my website the cat brought in a dead toad? frog? waste not want not huh its a wonder why the R.S.P.C.A dont ban cats as they are crewl as they come + every one owns one! I remember my mothers cat killing my hamster when I was a boy and leaving guts evey where for me to find if cats were banned hammy would have had a long and fuitful life. yet they bang on about exotics ahhh dont you just love logic!

[Chris Sainsbury]

No it was in the UK but I cannot dictate to anyone how to conduct there own lives or hobbies legal or not only observe I have also seen video footage however most time no sound so you don't hear the cracking of bones etc personally I don't have a problem with feeding live food verts anfibs inverts anything that a tarantula could over power but due to legal reasons I cannot feed as the people that make the laws are god and place values on life forms just because they look cute not that a life is a life regardless of what sensual awareness it may have. there are people I know that have the self awareness of an amoeba but still drive a car!

I agree with you on many points. I too also have no problem what so ever if others wish to feed live vertebrates to there animals, its up to them (as long as they don't get found out about it in the UK) lol. But by the way you have written it;

" life is life regardless of what sensual awareness"

is not so clear cut as all that. I don't believe it is banned because of a cute and cuddy factor but on some other moral grounds like the ability to show its awareness that its in pain perhaps? I don't know!.
On your grounds of "life is life regardless of what sensual awareness" would it therefore be ok to feed a lion in a zoo new born unwanted babies? A big leap I know but so was the "there are people I know that have the self awareness of an amoeba but still drive a car" comment.

There will always be Impressionable people im afraid these people close your eyes now!

Correct and that's my point. By telling them that the Native wildlife is getting rarer it may persuade them not to collect every frog etc they can find for tarantula food as a cheep alternative to frozen mice which would do just as well.

This is a desktop from my website the cat brought in a dead toad? frog? waste not want not huh its a wonder why the R.S.P.C.A dont ban cats as they are crewl as they come + every one owns one! I remember my mothers cat killing my hamster when I was a boy and leaving guts evey where for me to find if cats were banned hammy would have had a long and fuitful life. yet they bang on about exotics ahhh dont you just love logic!

Now your at it now.....compareing human emotion to animal emotion! Is the cat being cruel in its eyes?just because it seems cruel in your eyes? After all is it not in its nature/instinct to hunt? But is it in mankinds nature/instinct to feed living things to other living things? Anyway I feel this is totally irrelevant to the topic as was the picture.By that I don´t mean the picture offended me in anyway,but what was the point in it? I belive its common knollage that tarantulas can eat frogs!

[RichardDegville]

I don't know!.
On your grounds of "life is life regardless of what sensual awareness" would it therefore be ok to feed a lion in a zoo new born unwanted babies? A big leap I know but so was the "there are people I know that have the self awareness of an amoeba but still drive a car" comment.

LoL behave yourself! mind you they do cry a bit regarding the amoeba crack I was refering to the sunday driver brigade LOL which I would help thow to the lions!

Correct and that's my point. By telling them that the Native wildlife is getting rarer it may persuade them not to collect every frog etc they can find for tarantula food as a cheep alternative to frozen mice which would do just as well.

Yeh I agree.

Now your at it now.....compareing human emotion to animal emotion! Is the cat being cruel in its eyes?just because it seems cruel in your eyes? After all is it not in its nature/instinct to hunt? But is it in mankinds nature/instinct to feed living things to other living things? Anyway I feel this is totally irrelevant to the topic as was the picture.By that I don´t mean the picture offended me in anyway,but what was the point in it? I belive its common knollage that tarantulas can eat frogs!

But I am human so can only look at it from this stand point how do we know cats just play with a kill for fun?

But is it in mankinds nature/instinct to feed living things to other living things?

Man! we have to be the most sadistic manipulative evil animal to rome the planet (time for a matrix quote lol) " mans a virus he eats up everything then moves on" look at the planet now few more years no ozone more war more deforestation etc etc etc so feeding a small mammal live to a tarantula is hardly a sin huh when looking at the bigger picture food for thought!.

Anyway I feel this is totally irrelevant to the topic as was the picture.By that I don´t mean the picture offended me in anyway,but what was the point in it? I belive its common knollage that tarantulas can eat frogs!

yeh our debates gone way off how to kill a mouse ( charming thread huh hope the R.S.P.C.A dont read it ) so I think ill end it here for now.
BTW the frog pic was for fun!

Slighty edited by Admin

[Oderus]

This is not always the case! I once fed a live baby mouse (pinky) to an adult Poecilotheria formosa,(your allowed to do this in Germany) which it took quite quickly and proceeded to feast on it strate away. The baby mouse however did not die a quick death and continued to squeak for around 45 minutes! After this incident I have never fed live invert food to my tarantulas.Belive me this is kind of offputting!

This does not surprise me too much many "feeding vid's" that get posted on internet fora of spiders ect killing vert prey tend too be be quite short we dont know if the mouse starts kicking again after the cam is turned off, bare in mind spiders tend not to wast venom (like many other animals) if the prey does not put up too much of a fight it maybe happy too sit chewing at the prey without killing it out right (as sometimes happens with invert prey)

the people that make the laws are god and place values on life forms just because they look cute not that a life is a life regardless of what sensual awareness it may have.

This is true im sure most invert's are capable of at least a little more then there pre-programmed behaviours but (and it's a big but) if the law also granted them more respect this would be a thread called "freezer or head pinch which is the best way to pre kill a cricket"

I couldent say I dont know if its legal or not but you know how people get slammed on forums at even a sniff of feeding live verts let alone killing them yourself beforehand so thats why I put what I put.

Yup pre killing verts as animal food is legal and no one would "slam" anyone for talking about it on any fora iv visited herp or invert (live feeding is another matter for many reasons).

( charming thread huh hope the R.S.P.C.A dont read it )

As far as the rspca go we already know many of there "bigwigs" would like too see any non domesticated animals not kept as pet's (some go as far as anything that has to be caged in anyway) im sure they keep there eyes on fora like this and if not them the more extreme AR groups.

[AndyM]

Rich.

I wasent having a poke at ******* etc

Can I suggest that you choose you words more carefully.

I and many others who have worked with SEN children consider the use of such terminolgy to be derogatory and offensive, as well as a huge contradiction in terms.

Regards,

Andy.

To the moderators, please have a look at the above quoted sentence.

Andy - point noted and the offensive word has been ammended, I am sure Richard did not mean any offence but could have choosen a different word.
I have amended Richards qoute to what I believe he was trying to convey.

This thread is now locked and and cannot be replied too. A really interesting thread on a tricky subject. It has run it course and any futher comments are not needed.

Mark Pennell
BTS Webmaster and Admin